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    Max Armbruster
    Max Armbruster
    CEO Talkpush

    Recruiters that Think like Marketers

    Episode 54 title cover copia 2

    Recruiters and marketing?

    Absolutely. They have to sell the job and the company to their candidates! Gone are the days of job seekers having to chase your company. As a recruiter, it is up to you to boost your brand online.



    Adam Chambers - Applichat

    David Lim - ThinkCrumbs

    Max Armbruster - Talkpush


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    Don't feel like listening? You can read the entire transcript right here. 👇

    Welcome to the think like marketeer: marketing strategies for recruiters webinar. Talkpush created these webinars that we do believe that with a couple of gifts from marketing, we can definitely level up the game of each recruiter in the recruiting industry.


    I'm going to start with welcoming Max. We're very lucky to have you. He's our CEO at Talkpush. So max, the word is yours. Hello everybody. Good morning. Good afternoon. And good night wherever you're logging in from. I'm the CEO of Talkpush. We are a recruitment software company, which deals with really high volume and we've  built a bunch of technology that helps us  manage wide recruitment funnels, which requires.Very wide advertising and marketing funnels. So naturally we've had the opportunity to work with cutting edge recruitment marketing teams who are spending hundreds of thousands of dollars in marketing and investing in their content strategy. And so on. And in our years in the space, we've come across some really like I said, cutting edge professionals and people who are deep experts in the field of recruitment advertising and so I'm really excited to see what we're going to hear from our two speakers today. Adam Chambers and David Lim who represent Applichat and ThinkCrumbs and who are two experts in the field of digital advertising particularly on Facebook and other high volume channels.


    I thought I would kick it off by saying, well, first of all, we live in a world where it's never been easier to have  a lot of data and so the problem has in a way shifted from where can I get candidates to, how can I get, how can I manage all those candidates, which is a very different problem and this is not simply a trend which dates back from, I mean, this trend staded a long time ago, 20 years ago. But it's actually still accelerating, meaning. In 2020, you can get way more leads than we can get in 2019, strangely, even though in 2019. And it was already probably an age of plenty full in terms of generating leads and candidates in 2020, it's even more so we were just commenting on the fact that the cost per questions, cost per leads has dropped considerably over the course of this crisis and and on top of that, the trends that had already staded with some of the aggregators that are providing free traffic to employers, such as Facebook jobs and Google jobs are further accelerating during this time.


    People have more time at home, more time to browse, more time to search, more time to apply for jobs. And so the volumes are going up and I Talkpush. We were lucky enough to work with some of the largest employers in the world, and we can see their candidate traffic has increased considerably in a while.Companies were still feeling a little bit, and shy about hiring. We have more than double the volume of candidates that we had back in March in the month of June and that is not driven by advertising. You know, people have not increased their advertising budget but they are getting more volume, nonetheless.So does this mean that advertising is over advertising is dead, not at all. I think  there's two facets to advertising. One of them is indeed finding your audience. The other one is making sure that you're attracting the right kind of audience and today the opportunity is there for you employer you know, employment branding, experts to attract the right kind of audience by having a very differentiated message which is where the battle lies today.


    Anybody who spends time on LinkedIn and I assume everybody  on this webinar has spent time on LinkedIn as a talent acquisition professionals do we'll agree that it has become an overload of spam of noise. And it's very hard to get hurt, very hard to stand out kind of the way Facebook was a few years ago.


    and in this environment I've seen over the last few weeks, some advertisers who were able, some employers were able to adjust their strategy very quickly, sound more authentic, create more unique content and win market share in that sense and in the war for talent, win market share and win mind share by standing out from competition in a world where everybody is advertising everybody is moving online, where every company is doing webinars as well. It's not just Talkpush then. It really boils down to the quality of the content and, you know, the authenticity of the message. So that's kind of leveling the playing field. It means for people who are on this call, who do not have a big advertising budget.


    Okay. We don't expect that you do, you know, entering into Q3 2020. Obviously your finance department is not going to give you an increased social media advertising budget compared to the beginning of the year, considering the recession. But  even if you move 20% of your ad spend from job boards to social media, you're going to be able to experiment and do a lot of things with that tiny 20% bunches because if you have a real differentiated message where you can talk about something that you're doing, that's uniquely speaking to our time. For example, you could talk about how you're taking care of your work from home program or your company culture, or how you're adapting to the new normal, this kind of messaging.


    We'll find an audience in this current climate and will allow you to attract. A lot of candidates for a fraction of the cost that it would cost you under normal circumstances and that it would cost to only six months ago. So this is a great time to experiment. And I think that this is what we're seeing  with our customers.


    Pablo if you could share the slide that I sent you with the data. Thank you. This is the number of job applications that are coming through our software and through Facebook jobs and Facebook job currently does not charge for advertising.


    Meaning these applications just come in free of charge and are passed on directly to our customers and so far Facebook is not advertising for it. They will, at some point in the future we have the same trend actually happening with job boards and with aggregators like Google jobs.


    And so, you know, as I said,  there's more volume, more volume than ever. So I think the battle has shifted a little bit to who has the biggest budgets to who has the most unique voice. And I think there's nobody better qualified to speak on this particular topic  than Adam who has staded a company called athlete chat, who specializes in conversational interfaces for recruitment and, and social media sourcing.

    So with that, I'll pass it over to you, Adam.

    All right. Thanks very much, Max. I appreciate your introduction. Yeah, we're using Facebook jobs a lot, so in my age, We help recruiters like you all source for hard to fill in roles using social media. So we're all about getting in front of account continents, where they like to spend time on making it very easy for them to apply to your jobs.


    So what I'm going to talk about today is how we're using the hub specifically for nurse hiring, which is a major job shortage in the USA, but  this can work for any role really using social media. So yeah, I'll reach out. So our specialty is really a consultative approach. Sourcing difficult possessions. So clients will come. They often say, Adam, we can't hire enough nurses. We've used it indeed. We've used it onLinkedIn. We've tried cold calling it, but it just isn't working. Hi, can we get in front of our ideal candidates?


    And how can we actually get them to change their lives and come on, work for us, the solution and  the way you do that is by making them offers. So what I'm going to discuss today is really about how we can make offers to our candidates and how we can disrupt the patterns of scrolling on social media to make them stop, look at the ad and actually take action on it.


    So I, first of all, outline, if you're not really convinced of the route, either the impressive opportunity which exists so much over there, I'm just going to reiterate it and make it relevant for jobs. So 10 times, many people. Every single month would go on Facebook or Instagram all the job boards and on indeed.


    So yeah, people are going on okay. More people are going on. The job board is on, I think about 60 to 70% of nurses would go on Facebook or Instagram every single day. And the average person with him has a demographic mood span, two hours or more on the sites.


    So charge the people who are scrolling for two hours or more. Each day, 60 to 70% of them are doing it. And these platforms run off advertising. So, you know, Facebook owns Instagram as well, and they make money by serving odds to customers. In this case candidates, whenever someone clicks on the ad Facebook makes money.So they will share that ad. The opportunity compared to job boards. I just want to make it a little bit more clear if we looked up our demographics. So we looked at Toronto and Canada and we just looked up nursing jobs and we found 974. Next step. We looked at those hospitals, agencies, health authorities that  advertised on deed, and we only found 20 of them posting jobs on Facebook.


    So nobody else you think about the visitors to jobs posted ratio for Facebook? It's over 3000, but on the job board, it's five to 10. So massive opportunity, massive market, and a massive opportunity to get ahead of your competition here, trying to recruit the same people. However historically the reason my agency exists is there's a bit of a problem with sourcing on Facebook.So of all the different categories of jobs or of ads posted on Facebook and Instagram jobs are to get the lowest amount of clicks. So less than a third of the best performing category, which is legal ads. And my opinion, like the reason for this is threefold. So a lot of job ads just stad with saying, we're hiring.


    This is what you get, submit your resume here. The fact is most people on Facebook are scrolling. They're looking at pictures of cats that they are selling to their friends, and they're rarely gonna have time to go away and create a CV. And because there are what we call passive candidates. So mostly not seeking a new job.


    They're rarely going to have an up-to-date CV to Sandy. They're just not gonna disrupt their schedule and disrupt their crucial experience to go off and go over to their computer and create a resume that kind of leads into 0.2, which is making a direct call to the options. So asking people who have seen your ad for the first time, perhaps to learn about your company, your hospital for the first time, to create a whole job application for you.


    The third would be really shouldn't be yourself in the food. If you do a great job on the ads, but not on the targeting, whenever someone clicks the ad, if they go to a career site where they have to meet a client, create a password, tell their life story, and register all that stuff it disrupts the experience for the candidate.


    It actually results in Facebook showing your ad less. So Facebook prefers to show out which gets more engagement and results because then. Customers will pay Facebook more money. So whenever you put up an ad, which links to a career site, which doesn't generate applications and isn't more optimized for mobiles your ad is going to perform less.


    You're going to waste money. You're going to sort of go around in that circle of wasting budget, not getting enough candidates, looking for another solution and wasting money. So what is the solution to that? I want this to be very actionable, something which you can all Google and implement in the next couple of weeks to source more candidates from these sites.


    Sum it up in three words, it's called pattern breaking offer. So to help me visualize this I've split it into three. As three separate divisions, which I'm going to sort of use as the structure for my presentation here. So a pattern break and offer is something which stops your ideal candidate from scrolling, convinces them to engage with your job up and then provides an easy way for them to exchange information with you.


    Whenever you advertise outside of job boards  on sites like Facebook and Instagram, you're competing against McDonald's, you're competing against the gap bowl. All the biggest brands in the world are vying for attention and they will use this exact same strategy. So they will post an offer, which stops the target customer from scrolling.

    Keen to engage in and provide an accessible guy for them to make a purchase. So this isn't something I invented, like in my bedroom here this is something which has been tried and tested and billions of dollars being spent on this. So before we get started, I just want to do a little bit of a pool for everyone watching.


    You're going to have the opportunity to vote on this and have a guess how many feeds does the average person scroll on their phone each day. So just sorta like there's are many feeds, would people scroll on their phone per day?


    Drum roll.


    All right. So I'm just going to give a few seconds, Mary. There it is. So those are the results. 600. Okay. I'm interested. If anyone here scrolls 600 feeds a day and what are you looking at if you do? So I think I would be in that 600 mark, cause I'm just always like on Facebook for some reason. The answer is I can go to the next slide.


    Here are actually 300 feeds a day. So that's the size of the Statue of Liberty, pretty hundred feet today. You need to do something which is going to stop that person in that 300 feeds Germany. And that's, that's really what I mean. When I say stop the confident scrolling, you need to put something in front of them, which makes the form pause mixed up.


    This is interesting. This breaks the pattern, and this makes me want to do something about it. The biggest stung, the most effective way to do that is through an image. So we, as humans, love to look at things. We're very curious creatures. And whenever someone sees a striking sort of emotional image, which has bright colors, which is shiny objects, they will usually have a look at it at least for a few seconds and give it some of their attention.


    I also want to know a bit about what images do you think work on? What images do you all use for job ads? Could you let me do one another? Paul, who would use stock photos like this one in your job?


    Alright, perfect. So with people answering there is let me share those results with you.


    Oh, cool. So we got absolutely. No, I mean I'm 30%. Yes. 30%. Sometimes I would probably fall into like, I think sometimes if I have to its,  fair enough. I would say if you're a staff. It's fair enough. Sometimes you can't go under the employer and put an ad up, but  if you work in a hospital or if you're working in house, in my opinion, really, there's no excuse for using stock photos because it's so easy to just take your camera go and take a picture of people working doing their jobs.


    So we actually tested this, we put up a stock photo like this one on the right, and now we put up a photo like this one on the left of real people. This one on the left hair dog, 50% better conversions. Whilst we can't be a hundred percent sure why few things, if I'm scrolling that 300 Feed a day, one of the things that is gonna make me stop is if I see someone who's exactly like me, who is in a similar situation to me, So if I was a nurse I saw the one on the right here.


    Let's just talk a little bit about what would interest me. So there's three nurses in this photo or three medical staff, at least you've got a one smiling looking on in the background. You've got a sort of mother and father type figure here, and you've got a child in the middle, in a car. The research behind this was we talked to the hospital and said, what sort of situations do your nurses enjoy being in?


    And they said, Hey, Joey, caring for families are seeing their patients happy whenever you compare that to this photo. Here it's a much more realistic situation. It's a much more natural situation. It really just breaks the pattern of other stock photos on social media, because even though we saw.


    Like a percent of people use stock photos and really most recruiters people's job out. Something really got to the stage yet where they're not using them. I even heard reports of like different hospitals using the same stock photo to advertise their rules. Whenever you use something, like I said, it captures attention.


    It helps people's eyes looking deep into the soar, the, of it. And it really just sort of makes them stop looking at it. And that's really all you got to do with the image in your social media job, replace the stock with the reality and get people to stop and sort of drink in the photo. So once you've done that, you've made them stop.


    You've used an interesting photo. Maybe you've got it from your branding team, your marketing team, or even if you've just gone into the office and took a photo. How can you convince people to actually engage with your advertisement? Because. If you look here less than half percent of people on Facebook would ever click a job, this is the most important thing, the most important part of your offer.


    Really this is about, as I said, being like big brands making offers, which got people clicking. So again, I want this to be really actionable. So if you're taking notes, split this into four parts, and that will be calling out your ideal candidates, pinpoints, which they would currently name the clear reason for taking the option.


    Let them know why the new rule will be of direct benefit to their lives. Highlight the urgency of taking action. So I'm going to show you an example of a job ad for nurses. ICU nurses. In Toronto. And we actually managed to hire two nurses for three and a half thousand dollars using this ad, using this offer which see if the client paid 30,000 and what they would have paid staffing for.


    So here's this $30,000 job. And I'm going to explain that if you look in the second paragraph, you can see, you know, we even had a mistake in the punctuation. We didn't put a question mark after the nurse even though  it still performed really well. That's because we made a direct offer to our ideal candidates.


    Talk through this. That's how it will look on how this is structured and how this was built. You can see in the first line, we stand off with calling out the audience. So again, if you want people to stop scrolling so much, you have to communicate directly with them. If you put in the first line of your advertisement, their location and their job title, it's gonna trigger something in their brand compared to, if you just say we're hiring.


    So it says, Hey Toronto, I see nurses whenever we just sorta, yeah. Check, check off each of these, we're going to call them like their pinpoint next. So the way you do this is you talk to your current employees. You talk to your current candidates and you talk amongst yourselves as recruiters. And you say what the ideal candidates our employees dislike about either their current job or their previous job.


    So with this hospital, it was ICU nurses having to do administration. So that's the pinpoint. We have identified that they don't like doing administration. They want to focus on caring for. The sickest of the sick when they need the nurses the most. So that's what we did. We called it the pinpoints they experienced in their current job.


    We drastically reduced the album. So again, think about it, think about what difficulties your ideal candidates are facing, and then employ that in our advertisement. Next, you want to name the clear reasons for taking option and then kind of let them know how it will be of direct benefit. So you can see here, we put sort of three little texts and the main reasons they would get an education bursary and to get the opportunity to do less admin and follow their calling.


    And then they could experience working in a digital age. So really kind of drilling home. The benefits of taking action is going to make someone do it. It's much better than talking about yourself, saying we're a world-leading hospital, and have this many patients spending beds. People don't care about that so much.


    They care about how the ad is going to change their lives and their career. So if you say we're a world-leading hospital, what's that going to do for me? We could have said , we're a technological hospital. We've got an advanced theater. We did bring that in. We say we have a digital command center, but the benefit of that to you is informing your decisions better using hospital idea.


    So make it all about the benefits to the candidate. Really focus on them instead of yourself. Final one I want to point out is the urgency aspect. So a lot of major Browns will do this as well, say limited to a mine or a limited time only. And even if you can hire anyone you gathered, there's always going to be a limit to the amount you can process.


    So I would encourage you to say no where, either we're seeking one person, two people, five people for this rule, a soup that people take action on, have a bit of urgency there. So that's an offer. That's an example of an offer. If you would like after this webinar. Create something a bit like this.


    Even you can do it on a job board or on social media and then send it to me. Chambers on LinkedIn on our that, you know what I think about it, again, review this slide. So here's the four points about making an offer and take massive action, put something out there, see how it goes. The final point I want to make.


    So we had our image, which makes them stop. We have our offer, which makes them want to take action. Now we need to provide an accessible way for them to take the next step. So don't ask for a resume and don't send them directly to the homepage of a career site where they need to search for a rule.


     That's very difficult to track. There's several ways you can play this. So instead of actually putting on your Joe about applying, you could say click, learn more to find out if this is a good match for you. Or fix our message to find out how much actually you can earn. What this does is this gets more people to engage with your ad.


    So Facebook will know that people enjoy engaging with. We're going to promote that above. Say the competitors are, who only get people click and who won't they apply. I always recommend putting a bit of automation screening in between the click on the application. So you can use a landing page or a chat bot, like Talkpush to ensure only qualified people get through.


    But just because social media sites are built on a paid advertising model, they always promote the outlets, which get the most interest and engagement from the users of the site. So it's really useful to trial these different calls to action, to see which one your convenience respond best to.


    Just to sum up, I'd love to answer any questions you have at the end. There are three kind of main points that you want to follow here in advertising on social media. So, number one is you want to stop people scrolling about 300 Feed a day by using a real life image. Then you want to convince them to engage with the ad with a relevant offer, which speaks to their deepest desires and highlights the benefits of why you can solve their problems.


    And then number three, you want to provide an accessible way for them to exchange more information, stad a conversation with you. So I hope this helped sell me a message on LinkedIn. If you have any questions, I have this, my name, this is my LinkedIn COVID or whatever. 

    Thank you so much for that. Thank you. Those are great advices. I really appreciate it. And like you said, any questions, please feel free to put it on the shack and we're going to go over at the end of the webinar, answering those questions as well. So we do have our next speaker which is David Lim.


    Let's really have you. Thank you so much, Navy. He is performance marketing lead for think trumps was gonna, who's going to talk now and give us some great advice, some to just thank you so much, David. Awesome. Thanks, Pablo. So hi everyone. My name is David and I am the founder of ThinkCrumbs.


    We are a performance marketing agency, essentially. We utilize all types of paid advertising across the board in all of them. And one of them is also in, in the, in the jobs industry. So today I actually wanted to go over some action steps that you guys can take immediately to actually elevate the processes that you already do at the moment.


    So let me just share my screen.


    Awesome. All right. So first things first, what I actually wanted to go over was how we communicate with our existing audience, right? Today, I actually want to go about controlling the narrative. And it's more on optimizing your ad strategies for your ideal customer experience. And when I say customer for you, for some of the people we have today, it may be candidates that you are ideal candidates that you are looking to hire, or it can even be customers that you want to get.


    So these fundamentals can be essentially used across. So are we communicating the right way, the talent in the context of actually hiring and talent acquisition, we want to make sure that we fully understand who we're speaking to. Right. So let's say we go into more specific, such as are, do we know how we should be speaking to people based on their position based on their technical requirements or be based on certain talent personas the way I would speak to somebody on the rank and file level versus somebody I'm speaking to at the C level or managerial level is definitely different.


    They both have different aspirations. They both have things they are both comfortable with and they both have different drivers of motivation. So going back to what Adam was actually saying before in hand and how we draft up your actual ad in terms of copy you want to make sure you first understand how you can actually speak better or communicate better through your talent personas.


    This way you have a higher chance of actually stopping them, but from the very onset of advertising, right? You don't want to be like every other market  out there just pushing out something, you know, I'm applying now just to go to a job that ends up in the career page. So those things, every other person, every other company will be doing.


    So how you can essentially stand out is from looking at and scenario working backwards, right? So based on your customer personas, based on your higher purpose thousand personas you want to make sure to understand what they really want. And what their fears, their motivations are and utilize those data points to actually improve the copy.


    A fair advertisement. So that's the first part, right? So let's say we already understand who we're speaking to. We already understand who, how we need to speak to these individuals. The next up is we have to now understand how to utilize the existing platforms. Right. When I say existing platforms, this is for the example of Facebook.


    So let's talk about your ad objectives. Now, for most of you out there who have already done advertising that say on Facebook you're probably know that Facebook offers you different types of ad objectives. Now why it's important to actually look at this in the first place. Number one it will heavily affect the cost of advertising that you do for your business.


    And again, this isn't just for hiring. It's also for other industries as well. Now how it works essentially is that you have a little bit of machine learning involved in advertising which is why myself as a performance marketer, we always make sure to take a look at the data. So let's get into it.


    From the leftmost side of my screen you'll notice that  it says brand awareness or reach. Facebook offers an ad ad objective called brand awareness or reach, right? So with brand awareness and reach the you're telling Facebook, I actually want to find more people or just reach more people regardless of the quality of the audience, or regardless of the quality of who you're speaking to the, the ad will help you find more people how you can actually augment this type of advertising is of course you do more detailed targeting, but overall brand awareness and reach objective will help you find more people.


    Now I do suggest to use the brand awareness or reach if you're at the scale, if you're a bigger company and really want to reach out to a massive scale, right? Not just something that's hyperlocalized or something that's focused on on just one city. Although it is a possibility the brand awareness and reach objective is really for a massive scaling in terms of getting people aware in terms of brand recall people are aware of your brand in general.


    The example that I actually placed here is by McDonald's. So McDonald's was hiring, not just a rank and file level but more on at the managerial level, right? They were hiring restaurant managers. So what they did is that they push out this ad towards here towards a local group, a local asset.


    And the goal of it is really to make sure people are aware that they are hiring as a map for managers now that's one, this very specific case scenario when you're using brand awareness. Where you want to just reach more people. if you're a bigger company again, and your budgets   maybe  not really infinite.


    But then in the higher average level, then you may want to explore this type of objective because the cost of actually reaching the certain users is cheaper, essentially overall. Now the next ad objective in the middle is what I call a page post engagement or BPE as we call it now.


    The page post engagement ad objective I believe is much more specific in terms of campaign oriented push. The ad I did place here is from VSI via the call center. And what they did is they grabbed a group of individuals  from their company and they place a credit in the middle, right.


    Middle of the room. And in the each side of the curtain, You have two individuals, right? One individual who is an actual call center employee. And one, who's probably just a random bystander. And what they did was is that they asked the bank standard to give their opinion of what they think about call center employees.


    And, you know, the, mostly the opinions were kind of harsh. Call center employees are barbaric. They're not educated. So on the other side of the curve, then you have the call center employee just listening to all this. And what this triggers essentially in terms of advertising is emotion where I would use the page post engagement ad on Facebook is if you are.


    Very much running our campaign level specific type of execution where in it's for a limited time only I would say probably around the three to six month period, if you're running a very campaign specific, you know, you've got a production company, you made a very engaging video and you want to push it to a good degree.


    Then you may want to explore the page upon page posts and location. So how is it different from the brand awareness part? So in terms of actual optimization and machine learning the page post engagement gets people through their app, more to your certain posts. Okay. It's very different from getting people aware about your brand versus getting people aware of the type of campaign you are running at the moment, you know?


    So a brand awareness type of campaign, you can probably run for a longer period of time for a page post engagement campaign. If you're doing a very campaign specific objectives, then this is something that you want to do as well. Now onwards the third type of objective. And this is something that I believe more businesses are used to doing.


    It's more of a direct response type of marketing, which is direct and messenger or direct a messenger essentially means that you are optimizing your advertising to get people to message you on Facebook, right? As more specifically the messenger platform. And what this does is that the type of creative you can essentially use is more focused in terms of the benefits you are giving to your talent personas.


    And in my example here, if the salary is something that's very important to the people you're speaking to, then I see no problem why we cannot highlight the salary at the first onset of the ad itself, meaning the creative. So that's something that we can definitely do. Now, the thing about this is that you can be smad about it, right?


    So if let's say you are a multi hub type of business right now, and you're across the board, dealing with different types of languages, different types of people. So we can do hyper localized targeting that matches up with your advertising as well and direct messenger this way, it becomes more personal as well.


    And you have the ability to change the creative as you please. So that way you have a higher probability of actually getting people to respond to your ad. At the end of the day what I'm trying to say is we just have to make sure to take a look at all the different types of optimizations we are doing, right.


    Because if we are certain and if we're not really sure how each of these objectives have played for us, then there's really no benchmark. But then as we move forward, as we do a lot of more AB testing you'll be able to find out which one works for you guys better. Now. One very important thing to note is that the goal of an ad is to get a click.


    The goal of an ad is not to get a sale. It's not to get somebody hired immediately. The main goal of an ad is to get a click.  It's a different way of saying  the main goal of an ad is to sell the next. Right. So that's what I want to talk about as well. So the next step is actually what happens in your, we have a couple of use cases that can happen, right?


    So for example, On the left side of my screen. You'll see that. Okay. We have an ad. All right. It's a more direct response. Creative. Let's say rather when it's creative, we're looking for you. And what happens is that if I click on it, it might bring me to a landing page. Right? So that's use case number one.


    When somebody clicks on the ad. You can choose to bring them to a landing page. But something here that I see a lot of marketers and the businesses don't do as well, is that sometimes their landing page isn't conversion focus as we call it. So a conversion focused landing page is something where in, it's not just a big deal, some texts and an apply now button, right?


    It's not just that. Every other page looks like that. And we don't want to be that a conversion focused landing page in the context of hiring with include maybe a campaign video that I showed you earlier, a main power statement that you could actually implement on the page highlight the pains, benefits, and pain points of the thousand persona of your customers, or ideal hires that you're actually talking to this way.


    When somebody goes through the actual landing page, you will you, there's a, there's a conversation, right? I see it as relationship building. And as we go through the slides later on, you'll see why, how this can add up to your entire ecosystem. But the general idea is we don't want to just waste your budget to bring your hires and bring traffic to a landing page that isn't conversion focused to begin with.


    Otherwise you might see potentially 50 to even a hundred percent increase in our advertising. If you're just bringing them to a landing page that is not conversion focus. Right? Of course there will always be opt-ins and calls to actions on the landing page. It's just a matter of how we lay it out.


    How we communicate in terms of copywriting and making sure that we really know who we're speaking to now. The good thing about this is that you can actually automate the landing page as well with other solutions, right? Maybe you want to add in a scheduling system, maybe you want to add in a qualification questionnaire or maybe some third-party solutions.


    The cool thing about this is maybe you can even add a feedback loop, right? Where in the landing page essentially can qualify the audience before they actually get to you and be considered as a lead cause. If you're doing really massive hiring and you're reaching out to a huge number of people, you don't want to spend every waking second and every waking minute of your day, just trying to qualify these individuals.


    What you want to do is make sure that you also have a system in place where it automates that, that part. And eventually all you have to do is make sure that the final interviews, or probably just making sure that this really is a person that you want. Right. So definitely this is something that doctors can do.


    I do believe in learning, you can build very conversion focused landing pages. On top of Bush. Now the general idea of a landing page is to qualify and convert, right. Again, if we think about it, the fundamentals are the goal of every step right. Prior to actually getting the lead is to sell the next step.


    The goal of an ad is to sell the next step, which is to get them to visit the landing page. And the goal of the landing page is to sell the next step, which essentially is get them to opt in. Now again, this is where we have to make sure it's conversion focused, but at the end of the day, it's the qualification and conversion.


    Now, if this is something that you guys aren't doing, this is definitely  I do encourage you guys to explore how to improve  or let's say make your landing page a little bit more conversions. So let's go to use case number two. Now for use case number one, we're talking about landing pages, but for use case number two, and this is what I believe you guys do a lot of as well is instead of leading them to a landing page, you lead them straight to messenger.


    So. How that works is the main benefit of a direct messenger campaign is that somebody there's a need to leave Facebook to actually build a relationship. Right. What happens is if I click on the ad it probably leads me directly to messenger probably. It's an iframe inbuilt type of pop-up and I'll have the messenger chat right there, similar to what you see on my screen.


    Now the general idea is the same. The goal of the messenger is to always qualify and convert. And I do believe this is something that top push does very, very well. Where in if you're running. A response type of marketing, right. And you know, the benefits and features that you want to highlight. Based on the pain points we know of your talent personas, then there's a high risk more there's a likely chance at that.


     Your ideal personas or ideal hires will actually click through the ad. And we have a metric in marketing, it's called a click through rate, or as we call it a CPR which is the percentage of people  who click through after seeing an ad, right. Essentially doing everything that was just we spoke about over this webinar will help you improve your CPR.


    If you're spending a lot of money and you notice that your CTR is looking kind of monotonous, then it might be a good thing to actually take a look at improving your creativity. But then let's say you do realize that you are getting a lot of traffic, but not getting leads. Then you might consider improving your landing page or improving the copy on how your messenger bot the setup.


    Essentially messenger can do that all for you, right? It's just a matter of putting up the system making it a little bit more automated messenger can also qualify and convert all the way to the part where they can schedule a meeting for you. I've tried it myself. I've seen the capabilities and it's something  that I do encourage a lot of talent acquisition departments to utilize.


    It'll make the process a lot easier. And at the end of the day  you're not left with people who you don't want to hire. Right? You're left with people who are  prequalified and can provide you with value very immediately. So those are the main two use cases that can happen.


    Once you get a click, right? You can either bring them to a landing page or bring him to the messenger button. But the idea is the same: the landing page or the messenger bot qualify and convert the ad to make sure you get the clicks. So what's next? Right? So we know all of these things, we know how to run an ad.


    We probably set up the landing page and have probably taken a look at which one works in general in terms of creatives. But then I actually wanted to take this opportunity to go into a deeper level of understanding. I myself, I am very data oriented and very much focused on the numbers.


    And something that I'd like to speak to you guys about as well. Let's go into analytics and tracking. Right. You don't know what you don't know. If you're blind in terms of the certain data points or you are unaware of certain data points that could have provided you value, then that means there might be a chance that you're making decisions that aren't very data driven, right?


     If you're making decisions based on feeling and based on opinion without any data, then how can we be so sure that what's effective or what's ineffective? So that's why it's very much important to go into the deeper level which is the numbers, right? So I'll make it very simple  if you guys don't know, Facebook has something that we call a Facebook pixel. Now a Facebook pixel is essentially a piece of code. And again, this is totally free that Facebook offers for everybody, but you can install it on your own website, a landing page or whatnot now. And on the right side of it, you'll see a Google analytics or Google tag manager.


    Now Google analytics functions, same way. It's a piece of code that you can install on your website. It can solve on your landing page that can provide you with a wealth of data for you to actually determine if what you are doing is effective or not. So let me go through. Some of the data points that you can actually track.


    Number one with the Facebook pixel, you can actually track website visits. Now website visits is a very surface level data point that that doesn't really provide so much value other than how much traffic is going through your website right now, what you can actually, the good thing about this is that you can actually track how many people are visiting, which page off your certain way of your website, right?


    So let's say you have a career page and you have probably a dozen 50, a hundred career landing pages that you have. You know, and you can easily merchandise all of these pages on your website almost immediately. And what you want to do is use the Facebook pixel. You want to make sure you are able to track how many people are visiting which part of your website.


    And with the Facebook pixel as well, you can track your form submissions, right? So for every person who actually visits a certain page, let's say a certain career page, a certain thing, a job page, how many of them are actually clicking on submit form or actually clicking on your call to action button.


    Right. And why is it important to track this? If you have if in your IC do believe that you have con conversion focused landing page, and let's say you have a thousand people going to this certain page, 2000 people going to this certain page, but then your form submissions are below a 1% meaning only 0.5% of the people visiting this page actually design the site to actually apply.


    Then there might be two things that could be the problem there. Number one, you're sending the wrong traffic or number two, your landing page is not as conversion focused as you expected. Meaning you can take a look at adjusting the copy or. Adjusting the layout a little bit, right? So that's a few things that you can get from this data point.


    And of course you can track link clicks, link clicks is more of a top funnel or an awareness type of a data point where, and you want to make sure that you want to see how many people are actually clicking through your ad. Similar to how Adam was speaking about creating the perfect copy, not using stock photos, making sure that it's very real.


    Just, just drill down into reality, then you want to make sure if the actual creatives you are using are effective or not now going back to it. For myself, if you guys are using, let's say stock photos or more photos that are more organic either way, whatever it may be, you want to take a look at how much link clicks you are getting to properly evaluate.


    If it really is, if your hypothesis of this one will work better than the other really is true. Because if you, if let's say if we're running ads and we don't have any visibility on them, our assumption is that probably one way work better than the other, but we always want to make sure to let the data do the talking and not just our feelings, our opinions do the talking, right?


    So this is where the link clicks. This is where the click-through rates will come in. Another data point that we want to make sure to take a look at is page scrolls. A lot of people stay away from long landing pages, right? Or long form landing pages wherein you have a bunch of copies, a bunch of calls to actions, make it a little bit longer than the usual landing page.


    For, for myself, I do believe that I wouldn't shy away from long form landing pages. There is a lot of value to long from landing pages. It's just a matter of making sure that the copy you do implement on these pages are very much the right copy. And you're speaking to the right audience.


    So why is this data point important? And to give you an example, if you have a law firm landing page, somebody who actually goes through the page, let's say 50% of the page versus somebody who goes through 75% of the page. I think it is a valid hypothesis to assume that somebody who scrolls through 75% of the page is more likely to be more interested in the job that they are applying for or the action they are to take.


    So those are definitely some things that you guys have to consider now. Again, I don't want to take too much time on this, so let's move on to the Google analytics site now for the Google analytics side this is more on checking your bounce rate, right? So to give some context for bounce rate is essentially how many people clicked on your ad and go to the page, but don't end up taking another.


    Right. So this is the percentage of people who essentially end up not going through to another page or people who exited the page immediately. Right? So that's what the bounce rate is. If you're bouncing this probably around 60 to 80%, then that's a pretty high average. And you want to make sure you bring that down to around 50, 40%.


    What this means is that you were essentially trying to make sure that our page is more engaging. And we elevate the experience of the customer of the client, of your ideal hire as they go through your page. Another metric you do want to take a look at is tracking the time spent on the pages, right?


    How long are people actually spending on your pages? If they sculpted the pages, if around, if they scroll through your page 75%, but they are spending only around 10 seconds on the page. That means they just did a couple of swipes and then left. So merging these two data points will help you understand who it is, who it really is.


    You're trying to look for it. And if this individual already exists in your entire ecosystem, right. Because maybe if we're in our, if we aren't really tracking all of these things, then how do we know that they don't already exist? And this is something that's very important moving forward.


    Tracking the time spent on pages is a good indicator of how well you have built your landing page or probably some sort of website. It can either be a landing page website, whatever it may be. Right. And what Google analytics can do moving onto the next data point is it can also help you track the top pages being visited on your website.


    Right? So this goes back to my earlier comment about if you have a career site, that's it. And I really have nothing against career sites. It's just a matter of if it's conversion focused or not. If you have a career site, we'll probably. Then 50 separate individual career pages and each one with their own URLs, each one with their own traffic.


    You want to take a look at which one of your pages are being visited the most, right? Which one of these pages have the highest amount of traffic, which one of those have the least amount of traffic and why? Right. Is it because the copy is different? Is it because we're pushing out ads to different pages?


    Is it because if we push ads or the homepage we merchandise these pages more than the others. So it's essentially an ecosystem, right? You want to think about it that way. Where in you have multiple things working hand in hand at the same time, and it's never, it's never just, you know, one as to what there's always moving components of your whole ecosystem.


    So let me go through some of the action steps that you can actually take immediately. Once you understand what the data is pointing out. So with Facebook pixel, once, you know, everything that I just spoke about, you'll be able to understand which jobs need boosting based on prioritization. So if you have 15, 20 career sites career pages each with varying amounts of traffic and you notice that there are some pages that are not getting enough traffic, and assuming that you have a limited ad spend, you want to think about it very strategically where any move your advertising budget towards careers that are not getting enough organic reach or not getting enough priority.


    So this way you can essentially match your, your, your pipeline in terms of your, your talent acquisition. And what happens here is, again, this does not only apply to the industry of hiring and can apply to anything as these are the fundamentals. Now. The next question is, how can you actually leverage more on machine learning now with Facebook pixel?


    As we know, all know there's an algorithm, there's machine learning through it, whatever it may be. How you can actually leverage it is going back to when I first spoke about your different ad objectives, right? Facebook will offer you a ton of ad objective objectives that you can choose from.


    And there really is no one answer to what works for you. I do believe you need to go through a couple of AB testing which is why you want to do a lot of different campaigns. Take a look at which one works and based on what, what works, then we put more of your budget into it, right? It's really more on the cost effectiveness point of the scenario.


    At the end of the day, you want to make sure that you're getting the biggest impact with the smallest amount of investment. So that's what you can get. Now knowing what the data points are in Google and the Mythics, here's some things that you can actually learn which pages are getting visibility organically, and which ones are burned.


    And again, this is a matter of merchandising it on your site or  for lack of a better term organizing the layout on your site map or your website. Right? So if you notice that some of the jobs or some of the pages are not getting enough views organically, then you might as well shift out the way the site is positioned or where the actual URLs and the links  are to the site, right?


    And overall once, you know, all of these data points you'll be able to understand which pages have a low rate of conversion. And for everybody's context, a conversion rate essentially means how many people go to the website and how many upper, what percentage of those people actually decide to go to the next step or in this case, actually perform an action that you, that you want which is to click on the opt-in, but then submit the form, whatever it may be the higher your conversion rates, then the better it is that your, your, your overall ecosystem is working.


    The bet your, the money that you spend on Facebook is working harder for you. The lower your conversion rate. That means the money that you spent essentially might be the wrong audience, or it might be an audience with potential, but  it's not just there yet. So there's a lot of back and forth and type of in terms of analyzing this data that you need to do.


    But Overall, what I really wanted to share with you guys is the power of data. And I think the gap nowadays in terms of advertising is we don't appreciate this data enough as we don't know what actionable steps we can get from it. But really with the power of data, you can do almost anything.


    Right. So the next question is, are you actually missing out on your low hanging fruits, right? Are there already some ideal customers on your website, on your messenger bot that are already your ideal hires, but then just haven't opted in yet. Just haven't taken the next step. Just haven't taken action.


    So this is where retargeting comes in. So retargeting is a term  for advertising. We're following people based on the actions they've taken. Right. So, I'll go through this very quickly. On Facebook. If you remember early on in my slides, I did present a video. That's probably around a minute, six minutes long.


    Now, if you have a very engaging video, that's a little bit in long format videos, more than one minute, more than three minutes. And you have a varying amount of individuals who watch the videos in different types of duration, meaning you have people who watch for 10 seconds. You have people who actually watch it for 30 seconds, you have people who watch it for the overall.


    Now with the data points that I have explained earlier, you can actually track how many people are watching a bigger percentage of the video. Right? So what does that mean? I do believe it's safe to assume that the people who watch your video longer are people who are more engaged with your brand, people who are more willing to explore our relationship with your brand and people who are more willing to consider taking the next step, which in this case, as an ad is actually clicking, right?


    So what you want to do here is to take a look at people who are making these high-level events, but not but haven't clicked yet, right? So we're taking a look at people who have watched your video, 75%, 100%, maybe 30 seconds of the video, but haven't actually gone to the next step, which is visit your landing page, visit your bot or whatever it may be.


    A lot of people ask me  why this happens? And the answer is very simple. As you go through a person's daily life, there's a lot of things that can distract them from their feed. Maybe they need to go to the grocery store. Maybe they need to go do an errand. Maybe they just had to go to the restroom, whatever it may be.


    When a customer stops their journey at any point in time, as they scroll through their feed then we want to make sure we hook that customer back into the customer journey. And that's what this is essentially what we call it. Customer journey mapping, where you are making sure, you know, each touch point of your customer as they go through your whole hiring process and make sure there are no offs.


    And if there are ups, we make sure to hook them. And another example of this would be retargeting or based on message responses, right? So let's say you have people who have opted in your messenger bot and you have people who are ready to schedule an interview. But they just didn't click on that call to action button.


    So what happens here is that two things, number one, you can do automated follow-ups. This is something that talks to push can do as well. Automated follow ups are wherein you can detect when a customer has stopped, actually interacting with the bot and send them a message, right? And this is all automated or in terms of advertising.


    If you're going to use paid media to actually do this, then you want to retarget people who actually  message you within a period of time. If you're doing very fast scaling in terms of massive hiring on the daily level. And you're spending maybe around more than $500 and more than a thousand dollars every day.


    At some point what you want to do is take a look at your, your time durations, right? You want to retarget people who have not gone to the next step, let's say within one to three days and within the past time. So this means that people. Who have not opted in or who have not done the next step within the seven day, 14 day period.


    I'm not really people you're actually looking for because you want people who are more engaged. You want high level hires. You want people who can give you the most value and people who show you that kind of engagement, who show you that kind of interest at this phase already at the beginning.


    These are people you may actually want to consider retargeting because they can provide you and they have the behavior of what is indication to something that's worthwhile exploring. So that really is retargeting based on message response. And now we move onto the next type of retargeting, right? To find out if you're you do have these low hanging fruits in your website.


    This is where I think we can get very creative which is based on website visits. And I'll give you a quick example. Let's say I'm afraid of five job pages on my website. And there are a mix of rank and file to C level to managerial level, whatever it may be. Right. And we know how much traffic is going to each of the pages.


    We know the bounce rate. We know the page scrolls, we know all the data points, but then. It looks like that. With pages with high traffic don't actually end up with a lot of leads. So what does this mean? Again? It might be something because their customer journey must stop. Maybe they got distracted at one point, but then what happens here is that you can actually read, target or follow these people who have visited specific pages on your website.


    And we can define this by URL. So based on your website company ABC forward slash job title, right? So the specific syntax of each URL, you can actually track how many people and retarget people based on the specific URL they are visiting based on the syntax of your URL. So although  again, this is very surface level in terms of what you can explore in terms of our retargeting, your website visits.


    There are a whole lot of things you can go about in terms of retargeting, but these are, these are the main key action steps that you guys can already take to make sure that you are tracking all of these data points. And you're actually following up with your high level leads and leads who indicate the high-level value for your business, right?


    Depending on what they may  do, essentially I'd suggest to let the data work for you. You will always have assumed your actual behavior, and you want to always adjust and optimize.


    What do you think will happen will not always be the thing that happens and you always want to adapt to it. That's essentially what I want to convey overall. It always will take a village to make sure that your marketing is an ecosystem. I won't go through this. But I do have an example of how the ecosystem will look like we're in, you have your organic and paid traffic going through your pages.


    And you can request information from your customers all the way to the third part, which is qualifying a lead all the way to scheduling an interview. 


    Thank you. That's great. I hope everybody enjoyed this. I had a good time and enjoyed this webinar. And thank you so much. Thank you, David. Take you out. Thank you Max with time and see you next time. 

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